spoon said:Morals can exist independent of religious beliefs.
I consider myself both an agnostic and a highly moral person. Religion has long had a stranglehold on the concept of morality, and yet anyone can establish a moral code for himself or herself based on the values that person holds dear. Reject the basic notion that God is a prerequisite for morality and decide for yourself what you believe to be right and wrong, and you're at the basis of moral philosophy. This is not a new topic, but it's an endlessly rich one.
The argument pre-dates any Christian faith, so you can substitute Flying Spaghetti monster in there for fun.JC said::wtf: I'd logically chose the one without God in it.
I'm a no higher power athiest. Your question is what's called a false alternative. Which means you have "excluded relevant possibilities without justification." (I always keep my logic text book from college handy ) It's like asking me what's the best car is the world a Camaro or a Mustang and then saying it's a bad thing that I think a 911. I'm capable of arguing for either but this is a discussion forum not a debate class. We're not here to learn to argue, we're here to express our views. Your implied question is where do morals come from? My answer is that they are a societal notion, much like religion and God are.Trypticon said:The argument pre-dates any Christian faith, so you can substitute Flying Spaghetti monster in there for fun.
Depending upon what type of atheist you are, you can still say "suppose there is a higher power....." in order to answer the question. Not being able to make a supposition (even a outlandish one) so as to continue with a discussion is........... a bad thing.
The first option is an option for an atheist because it would mean that God did not create morality, does not define it, and (perhaps) has no effect on it- thus rendering God either irrelevant or (logically) non-existant.
I think that applies to today's America also. Maybe today's world? not sure haven't been to other countries =PSubyRSAWD said:I agree with JC. What could be moral in one society may certainly be imoral in another. For examle: An eskimo tribe leaves their people to die when they become incapable to care for themselves and others. That obviosly seems imoral to us, but to them it's what is best for their tribe.
neither. morals and morality are creations of women and weak people to keep the strong from following natural tendencies and taking what they want.Trypticon said:Is what is moral commanded by God because it is moral, or is it moral because it is commanded by God?
And no, there is no "both" option.