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Discussion Starter #1
when i deside to go turbo i will most likey get an ej22 shortblock and use my 2.5 heads and whatnot but what about cams? will be able to use the cams from my 2.5RS? what other parts will i be able/not able to use? starter...etc

thanks,
Nate
 

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You can definetly use the EJ25 heads. The cams I don´t know about actually, but if you swap over the heads then you will probably have to stay with the SOHC.

The starter from the EJ25 will work, remember, your only swapping in the shortblock. You don´t need all the other stuff with the engine. Subaru´s are like lego´s, everything from one car bolts to another.

Graham
 

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Nate said:
when i deside to go turbo i will most likey get an ej22 shortblock and use my 2.5 heads and whatnot but what about cams? will be able to use the cams from my 2.5RS? what other parts will i be able/not able to use? starter...etc

thanks,
Nate
WHY?
I beat a 16psi 2.2/2.5 Hybrid while I only running 8psi
the hybrid is even equipped with an Aftermarket ecu
due to gearing, and higher redlines etc, that car does make more TOPEND power (over 120), but under that, SPANKAGE!
 

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Discussion Starter #4
reliability and daily drivability. my MY99 has 74k on it turboing this motor would be a waste becuase by the time im ready ill have 150k on it (yes i drive a lot!) i also dont plan on using the legacy turbo. i talked to shiv at vishnu and he can make me a kit just like the 2.5 kit but with a slightly smaler turbo geared to work well with the 2.2 setup.

Nate
 

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The 2.2 is a waste of time and money. For the money you spend on that block, which is designed for a mere 165 hp, you could have put in forged rods and pistons in your 2.5, and had way more power.
 

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Why not just buy a new 2.5L block and build fro there? You could even get one of those semi-closed deck blocks from Cobb if you are worried about that.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
well i dont want a shitload of tourqe becuase this car will be a daily driver and i dont want to buy a million dollar tranny and second the ej22 shortblock is only 1100 bucks....if i use the 98 RS heads i will actually have a 2.2 litre wrx motor (yes the older WRX used the same heads as the 98RS and they flow better than SOHC heads) i can run 15 psi and have a very safe and fun car to drive. i dont care about beating anyone i just like driving and this would make my car more fun to drive. you guys are talking as if i have 4 grand to drop on just a block when in reality im a 20 year old college student who cant afford a cobb built motor. im doing this the cheaper way but keeping it safe. as for the shortblock only being meant for 165hp i beg to differ, the internals are made the same exact way the wrx intenals are made. it shouldnt be an issue if im pushing 250 to 280 hp. something a wrx takes very very well on stock internals.

Nate
 

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Nate, you are terribly misinformed. That motor stock is total crap. Look, pistons retail at like $550, rods are around $600. That is not $4000. There is a huge difference between 15 lbs of boost from the Legacy turbo and 15 lbs of boost on a T3. I have first hand experiance with the 2.2. The stock pistons melted rather quickly. The dohc heads don't flow as well as the sohc, btw.
 

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Oh ya, and 280 hp WRX motors use coated forged pistons. The Legacy motor does not have forged pistons.
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
well gentelmen, i cant speak from experience but what i do know is that i spoke with a very reputable subaru tuner after going over every setup possible and meeting my needs/wants this setup is optimal. i dont want a rocket, just a low 14 second car that is safe and fun.

Nate

p.s. and i want less tourqe than the ej25 turbo motor offers, i do not want to be buying tranys and i refuse to pay $2000+ for a gearset if the car is driven every day.
 

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Well first of all are you going to use the EJ22 block from a NA legacy or the EJ22T from the older turbo legacy. If it's the EJ22T there about $1,500 brand new. I don't think you want to use the NA block.

The EJ22T has a closed deck, oil squirters, 8.0:1 compression and you only lose a small amount of displacement. These hybrides have been succesfull with Paul Eckland's rally cars and others, but I'm not sure if Paul does any internal mods to the engine. The SCAA rules would apply there. When you mate the EJ25 heads to the EJ22T block the flows aren't optimal, but enough for the application you're looking for.

I've done the research for both routes. If you wanted to use your EJ25 motor you'll change the pistons, rods and probably the springs, valves, and cams to get the most out of the engine. This setup will smoke a hybrid, but it's $$. Also, it'll cap around 400HP due to the open deck which can be welded closed for about $1000, but it's difficult to find someone who can do it.

All prior information is from research not actual experience, so I could be wrong.
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Well first of all are you going to use the EJ22 block from a NA legacy or the EJ22T from the older turbo legacy. If it's the EJ22T there about $1,500 brand new. I don't think you want to use the NA block.
i would be using the turbo block and i believe they can be found for 1100 on subaruparts.com.

The EJ22T has a closed deck, oil squirters, 8.0:1 compression and you only lose a small amount of displacement. These hybrides have been succesfull with Paul Eckland's rally cars and others, but I'm not sure if Paul does any internal mods to the engine. The SCAA rules would apply there. When you mate the EJ25 heads to the EJ22T block the flows aren't optimal, but enough for the application you're looking for.
thats why im thinking about using the DOCH heads. they flow much better than SOHC.(hence why the wrx has them and why 99% of the time if you have two motors but one is DOCH its often the better performer) i think with piggybacks i can safely get the car to 250 to 275 hp while keeping it civil for daily driving.

Nate
 

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Well, if that is all the power you want, change nothing. The stock 2.5 is good to 300 hp when tuned right. To get that kind of power out of the EJ22, you will have to build it up like a built 2.5 anyway! And guys, I am speaking from very first hand experience here, not speculation or regurgitating crap I read on a messege baord.
 

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Nate said:


i would be using the turbo block and i believe they can be found for 1100 on subaruparts.com.



thats why im thinking about using the DOCH heads. they flow much better than SOHC.(hence why the wrx has them and why 99% of the time if you have two motors but one is DOCH its often the better performer) i think with piggybacks i can safely get the car to 250 to 275 hp while keeping it civil for daily driving.

Nate
Nate, I understand what you're saying on your side, BUT, THE SOHC RS heads, DO FLOW better than the dohc, they have been tested. Can a modified DOHC outperform the SOHC? Im sure it can.
Its your call on the 2.2/2.5 thing, but you will need to run more boost to make the same amount of power as a 2.5 running far less boost. (less boost is good!)
then again, the lowered compression helps with timing issues... But that is about all that motor has to offer...
Your call :p
 

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A couple quick notes:

1) The SOHC heads flow better than the DOHC heads.

2) When you get the EJ22T, you can only use one starter bolt rather than 2 because the EJ22T only uses 4 bolts to bolt to the tranny instead of 8 like the Phase-2 EJ25. It works fine with one bolt though.

3) I blew up my EJ25 at 4psi. With the exact same mods (including electronics) I can safely run 8psi with my EJ22T.

4) At the track, My friend was running the same boost as me (with forged dished pistons in his EJ25 which netted the same compression ratio as my car) and although he ran a faster time, I had more mph at the top. He ran a faster time because he launched hard (I think 1.8 sec. 60" time to my 2.3sec. 60" time!) and he shifted a lot harder than me (I don't want to break the Tranny)

5) The EJ22T swap is extremly inexpensive. The short block was $1,200 from subaruparts.com and I bought about $125 in gaskets and other supplies. THAT'S IT!

Contrary to what people are saying, I know from experience also that the EJ22T is capable of more bang for the buck than the EJ25. ANd trust me, my car at 8psi is much faster than my EJ25 at 4psi and I don;t need to worry about it breaking. :)

Eric
 

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Discussion Starter #18 (Edited)
can you tell me more about your setup....what ecu did you use? how did you tune it? what was you 1/4 time? also you say you ran 8psi, would you be able to run 10 to 12 psi safely with this setup? using piggybacks for tuning?

thanks,
Nate
 

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A welth of Legacy turbo info Dave's Legacy Central
"Q: Is my 2.2L engine the same as in the non-turbo models?

A: No, the engine displacement is the same, but the engine is very different. In fact, it's unique to the US market to the best of our knowledge. The block is of a closed-deck design, ideal for high-boost applications. The crank and rods are forged, while the pistons are cast. This combination should be good for at least 300hp with proper engine management without needing to replace any internals."

this is on an original motor, the ones you get new do not have the forged parts.
I run 9psi w/on the stock 1.8L ECU with no problem and pulls strong all the way to the redline. It does need proper engine management to get it's full potential, but the 2.2L turbo motor is NOT crap as some have stated :rolleyes:
 

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Yes it is. No forged internals. So, let's see, $1200 for low compression and less power? For that money you could have forged parts in your EJ25!
 
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